May's Deal Suffers Third Defeat - What now?

The decision is made by the European Commission. I don’t know if their decisions are put to a vote, but since we are one of only three countries that doesn’t already charge VAT on food we will be forced to fall into line eventually, it is a certainty.

Yes; there is ultimately enough scope for the government to ensure that it doesn’t fall foul of asking parliament the same question twice.

Yeah – these are unusual times!

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Ah, I see - I guess it’s a case of “this literally has to be voted on - whether we like it or not”.

Pretty much. It isn’t the job of the speaker to be obstructive; indeed, some of his decisions up until now have been… questionable.

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The European Commission is the EU’s politically independent executive arm . It is alone responsible for drawing up proposals for new European legislation, and it implements the decisions of the European Parliament and the Council of the EU.

It needs to be voted on and agreed to by all EU members before EU Commisions makes it law :wink:


Agreed, but I do bloody love Bercow - I think he is brilliant :rofl::rofl:


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Based on the link above yes, but unless all EU membes vote on it it will not become law, so if the UK stays in the EU and votes no then 20% vat on food etc will not come into law.

Booo he deleted the comment :wink:

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I would also like to point out the may need to be moved to the brexit thread :joy::joy::joy:

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would it be on a unanimous vote or a qualified majority vote for VAT levels to be unified , and if it was unanimous and the commission couldn’t get it through the EP how long do you think it would take to change it to QMV ?

No idea to be honest :wink:

But the EC has 1 member from each EU member state anyway to create the new proposed “laws”

I think it’ll be a people’s vote as nobody has a clue what to do.

But assuming remain wins, will there be a call for a trilogy ‘decider’ vote?

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The Council requires a qualified majority (55% of member states, representing at least 65% of the total EU population); the Parliament needs a simple majority.


How EU decisions are made

The Voting system in general

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If it did go to a people’s vote - what would you suggest the options are? As we saw earlier this week there are a number of possible directions it can all go in.

You’re entitled to your opinion, but please don’t say you’re being neutral but then only putting one side of the argument - and in a fairly niche area, if that.


was it one side of the argument, which would make it debatable that it was going to happen ? - or - a fact that VAT will be harmonised between member states ?? _ I dont know :slight_smile: but would assume that the EU wants a level playing field between members ?

It is true that it is a goal of the EU to harmonise VAT rates, which they’ve made some progress towards doing (e.g., they’ve set bounds in which rates can be set), but it is going further that what is currently law to suggest that “if we stay in the EU we will get 20 per cent VAT on food, books and children’s clothes”.

Indeed, such a proposal was made a while ago, and was rejected (not just by the UK).


which suggests to me that it could change ?


Ultimately, anything could change. But by making a prediction about changes that haven’t happened, you are expressing an opinion (so not “staying neutral”).


I don’t think there was anything wrong with the statement and sentiment that the EU may change VAT or Tax altogether.

I think it was the pre-emption of “I’m on the fence [on brexit/ way forward] but… if we stay in the EU than this…”.