Switched from Monzo to a legacy bank (Barclays) šŸ’«

This. I make no secrets that Iā€™m strongly on the side of how ATM fees turned out, and Iā€™d have been annoyed with any other option. I find it very fair because it is allowing reasonable usage for people whose overall pattern is more likely to be profitable/at least financially beneficial to retain. For example, I think cards should always be free - they shouldnā€™t be line item billed. If someone wanted a new card a week for looks/to make a mosaic of them/whatever, I think billing would be reasonable at that point.

However, letā€™s not hide in ā€˜itā€™s unfairā€™ and all those things that have been thrown around. It isnā€™t unfair, and itā€™s a distraction when terms like that are thrown around lightly. The reality is, some people (like me) like the new charging scheme if there has to be one, and others donā€™t. Iā€™m actually surprised how many donā€™t, since some free use is better than nothing, and I certainly would never pay for use. But thatā€™s me.

I think that on something like fees, getting community input is huge and a vote was a great idea. Fraud protection requires a bit more expert knowledge, but even there community input - not voting - would be great. Iā€™ve already given some of my thoughts on that topic.

I like this idea. Make voting easier will encourage more people to voice their opinion and capture a more unbiased estimate of the customerā€™s sentiments!

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I guess the difference is that in this case, Monzo explicitly stated that this will not be a ā€˜profit-makingā€™ exercise, so all the options that Monzo presented is basically ā€˜revenue-neutralā€™ or something along those lines, which is why theyā€™ve decided to ask the user base rather than to decide it themselves?

Iā€™d imagine if itā€™s an exercise to increase profit margin, then they probably wouldnā€™t want to ask the user base.

Then again if itā€™s an exercise to increase profit margin, and they come up with 3 options which are equally profitable/ un-profitable, then I think itā€™s still valid to ask users which method they prefer Monzo to make money I think, since they essentially have no impact on the bottom line, and the question is more on ā€˜ethosā€™ rather than ā€˜profitabilityā€™ā€¦

I do like that they are asking the customers though - shows that they appreciate us and how community-focussed they are. Maybe Iā€™m a bit too left-wingā€¦ ahaha

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The thing is that legacy banks are starting put together some of the features that Monzo/Starling/Others have introduced to their users. Eventually there will be little difference :disappointed_relieved:.

Monzo needs something to stand out from the crowd and a stark openness to itā€™s user might just be that. No other bank operates in that way, and so it is important that Monzo holds onto those policies.

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Thatā€™s actually why I use Monzo now over Starling. Both have amazing products that are so much better than my previous experience with HSBC but I actually believe in Monzoā€™s goals and even more I actually believe they really want those as opposed to just making money off me

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In the future, weā€™ll be doing this for sure :slight_smile: Think of the ATM fees vote as version 1 ā€” weā€™ve got big plans!

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Oh donā€™t repeat the debacle of the ATM vote. Have guts and make these important business decisions as a company, donā€™t be indecisive and opt for a vote by customers. While it may be good to consult customers to ask their opinion, leaving it to them to vote on important things is a barmy idea. Staff have access to data and can make a reasoned and astute business decision, customers will put their own thoughts and ideas first not the company and will vote for ideas of personal benefit not ideas for benefit of the collective body of customers or the success of the bank.

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IMO you (& a few other users in this thread) are missing the point. Itā€™s easy for experts - Monzoā€™s team - to come up with products, thatā€™s what the legacy banks do. But I think that what really matters is uninformed userā€™s perception of the various product configurations that Monzo has come up with.

The ATM fees vote was important because the fees will potentially put users off signing up for Monzo. The only way to find out which fees would be least likely to put users off signing up is to ask.

Thatā€™s also why the blog didnā€™t contain real world examples etc. because in the real world, Monzo wonā€™t have a chance to explain why the fees make sense in certain scenarios..

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I think the best middle ground is for there to be a vote in future, and for Monzo to take it on board instead of being the deciding factor. Obviously the options up for vote should be sensible options, ie - there was no option for ā€œno feesā€ in the ATM vote, because thatā€™s just not feasible.

Just some $0.02.

Shall we stop flogging the dead horse of the ATM vote though?

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Yep, and Iā€™m sure thatā€™s how the development team see it. :slightly_smiling_face:

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I was about to suggest a vote on your suggestionā€¦but letā€™s not :grinning:

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I think thereā€™s a balance. We still make the majority of business decisions ourselves (and lots of people here on the forum then complain that weā€™re not listening), but getting feedback and views of customers is incredibly important. Whether thatā€™s as a vote, or a survey or any other method, the alternative is hiding away in a black box and thinking ā€œwe know bestā€. I think if you do that, you end up with a big bank pretty quickly. Weā€™re trying to build something different.

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The problem with the traditional approach of asking for opinion is that there is very little feedback loop. People want to see their ability to influence changes. Opinions can be vague and have a diluted effect in large numbers. Often your feedback to a company will seemingly disappear into a black hole.

With a vote, you can actually see your vote making a difference and you can see other people voting against you. It also gives the company the ability to predefine a selection of suitable choices.

Not to say that opinions are worthless. Opinions could be analysed and displayed to the community with word clouds and suchā€¦ They are also a natural part of this forum and are great for idea generation phase.

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The problem is with following a vote is if it is bindingā€¦using it in an advisory capacity is best :wink:

We saw with the Brexit Referendum how about 51% of a 70% or so turn out meant about 35% of the electorate dictated the future for everyone else (who obviously should have voted - but that is another issue) and with Monzo votes you will also get a more active (or perhaps more acurately a more vocal) core of members dictate the direction even if it is not in the interest of the others

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Almost 6,000 users voted on the ATM fees poll, a large portion of whom were not regulars in this community. It doesnā€™t matter if the user is vocal or not, each user gets one vote which counts as much as every other vote.

And if, as Tristan says, Monzo continue to make these polls more accessible, the minority casting their vote will become even less of an issue. Obviously not every user needs to vote, Monzo just needs a representative sample.

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But if youā€™re going to let people vote and then just do what you want anyway, thereā€™s no point in having a vote in the first place.

Letting people think they have a say and then completely ignoring it is definitely not what I would expect (and exactly why I stopped using giffgaff)!

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So the problem is more that if the vote is close, something other than taking the vote by numbers should be done. Maybe a compromise of both options, or thatā€™s where Monzo use their expert opinion.

As @alexs points out the ATM had a large portion of voters who were not just based on this forum. In that vote the winning option was clear by the number of votes.

In Brexit you had 34% against, %36 for, %30 undecided. I say undecided because thatā€™s what you have to take them as. Itā€™s impossible to tell what they wanted. As there were only two choices, there was no choice but to go for Brexit. The failure for the against side was in the campaigning, not the vote.

If votes are made easily accessible through the app. Someone who didnā€™t vote would have to be taken as undecided or not caring. Thus any numerically significant win would be what the majority wanted.

My last point has been covered by @Chalky. Not following the outcome of a vote would dissuade people from future voting as there vote would not be guaranteed. Thatā€™s why every option must be vetted by Monzo beforehand.

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Which is why youā€™ll see we retained that option in the ATM fees vote :wink:

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Personally, Iā€™m super excited for what Monzo can bring in the future. I had intentions over Christmas to move everything over to my Monzo card but something stopped me. There are certain features which while I donā€™t use often I still need, therefore, Iā€™d still have to keep my Barclays account open.

Without a doubt, I think the rollout of the current account limited the number of new features Monzo could introduce but with more and more customers migrating, I think itā€™s right to assume more effort will be put towards new features.

With all that said, once I can have an IBAN attached to my Monzo account, thereā€™s Apply Pay support and thereā€™s a way to put cash into my Monzo account, Iā€™d be way more inclined to switch. For now, Monzo will just stay as a spending card so I can track the insane amount of money I spend at Starbucks each week! :coffee:

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This x100! It is the reason Iā€™m back with Starling. I did ask Monzo if they could re-attempt a DD that bounced but they refused. I was then penalised a Ā£20 default fee by my insurance provider and it now means Iā€™ll have this on my credit file. Not happy.

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