@nickh I agree with everything you’ve said, expect the repetition part. I think if a lot of people are echoing a similar sentiment there is a value in hearing it out.
I fully don’t expect Monzo to change any of their services on my behalf, and after all Monzo is a bank. There are plenty of those out there. As a customer I have a choice. If I choose Monzo then I can’t complain when they do things differently.
By the same token, Monzo can’t be surprised if I decide to use someone elses services because they provide a better experience for me.
I really agree, having a Monzo Vision might really help!
In general change is always very difficult to deal with, so people will resist it. The possibility to deposit cash is great! I personally feel that they are putting a feature out there that’s not finished. Almost as if they were rushing it because they know customers (me included) want it.
It’s just disappointing, from my humble perspective, having waited all this time and end up with a feature that is not viable…but that’s just me.
The balance in my legacy account is roughly £2. I keep it open for international transfers and cash deposits, my salary, DD and day to day banking is with Monzo. However, even if they provided seemless international bank transfer and limitless cash deposit tomorrow morning, I’d still keep my legacy account open, for a while at least, to make sure that everything works as intended. Money is no joke.
Having a Vision might help customer realise whether or not Monzo is really for them or not and what they are willing to pay for it and what it stands for.
That makes sense as the germ of an idea to me. Whether such a thing already exists or what form it may take would be interesting to know (open office or something written or both?).
I sometimes find it frustrating that many seem to think Monzo will ‘disrupt banking’ by offering everything that every other bank does. Which may be true. Or may not be. I don’t like the assumption behind the sentiment but I have no reason to dispute it or agree with it. That’s why I tend to fall on the “let them get on with it and see what happens” side which seems…unpopular at times
First, the lack of civility in this discussion has been disappointing. I think my colleagues have exhibited a huge amount of patience, but it’s getting to the point where we’re thinking about closing the thread.
Second, handling cash is expensive. You may recall the debate about foreign ATM fees - we initially didn’t charge anything for this (extremely costly) service, but a small number heavy cash users drove a disproportionate and unsustainable amount of cost. Heavy users were withdrawing 10 or 20x the average amount. Reluctantly, we had to introduce fees.
We don’t want to have a repeat of that situation where we roll out a feature and then have to retrospectively add charges because of a small number of users. So we’re applying a fee that will cover the cost from day one. This is not a profit-making exercise. If we can reduce the fee over time, we will.
I do think the deposit limits are probably too low and we’ll aim to increase them after launch.
I’m afraid I don’t believe that access to cash is some basic human right that Monzo is obliged to provide for free. Monzo offers a current account with dramatically lower charges than any high-street bank, and the only way we can do that is by keeping our costs as low as possible. That’s also why we don’t have hundreds of branches - they’re really expensive to run.
Thank you for your reply @tom and sorry for breaking my self imposed exile from the thread.
I don’t think anybody has ever said that Monzo should be obliged to provide a free account as a basic human right. Many people just believe that depositing money into a bank account should be free, some for the social reasons I gave earlier in the thread.
Maybe myself and others overstepped ourselves, but as always its due to the concern for your product, the perception of your product and because I think Monzo is doing a good in the world. To make Monzo more profitable, you want people to use it as their main salary account but all this has done is make me think of alternatives for my salary and just keep using Monzo as a spending card.
Hey @tom … Appreciate the reply. I don’t agree, but I respect that you’ve stood up and explained.
I’m personally a little concerned over the quoted comment. I know I was very active in the thread last night but I don’t think I was exhibiting “a lack of civility” - and I’m not sure anybody else was. Me and @Feathers had a healthy debate and purposely “shook hands” (if you can online!) at the end.
I’m worried that you might have seen this the wrong way or that a passionate debate over an opposite view has been seen this way.
I believe, and this is a personal belief, I admit, that handling cash is a “basic human right” - or a fundamental function - of a bank that should be free. In my view it’s up to you to work out how to do that.
But I don’t think that vaugely accusing a group of a lack of civility when we’ve actually been ok with each other is a good idea.
I have to disagree with this. I’ve followed this thread closely (and participated) and don’t think anyone has been particularly uncivil. I think the passion for the brand on one side of the argument and the strength of feeling about charging for cash deposits on the other has been palpable. This shouldn’t be seen as a negative.
It’s unfortunate timing for Monzo but when your biggest competitor (IMHO) rolls out their own solution for depositing cash with significantly better terms, including most importantly zero fees, this offering looks even worse. Also, that same competitor has managed to keep foreign ATM withdrawals free.
I think you could have started free, or a number of deposits free, then introduced further charges later if necessary without the same reaction as when charges were introduced for foreign ATM withdrawals above a certain limit. Last time round all of the advertising was around fee-free foreign spending and withdrawals, a core product feature. This was changed after everyone’s expectations had been set. By setting the expectations with cash deposits early on, I don’t think people would react the same way.
This is a positive move, though perhaps consider increasing them before launch so as not to attract more negative reaction from the wider audience?
I agree that access to cash isn’t a “basic human right”. It is, however, a basic requirement of any serious bank account. Charging people to deposit cash makes the product look more like the prepaid card it started life as. As for having “dramatically lower charges” than other banks, this is subjective. When it comes to foreign spending, yes. When it comes to overdrafts and (soon) depositing cash, no. In other respects the charges vary. Unfortunately this probably means those with money benefit and the poorer will end up paying more. I don’t think it makes money work for everyone.
I’m not knocking the product and I think Monzo has been a welcome addition to an outdated banking industry. That doesn’t mean there isn’t room for improvement and healthy debate and criticism should be welcomed.
I find it strange that some people are classed as ‘loyal users’.
Surely that’s part of the problem with new banks and the banking space - people don’t change, they don’t like change, which is why new banks struggle.
We’ve all changed so thus, we are probably willing to change again.
I’m gonna hang around and I’m OK with the charge, but it’s the limit which is made me apply for a competitor account. I’ve been waiting months for this feature but I can’t take the 6 month limit which is too low for me (I understand I am in the minority).
That competitor also has a very different business model which helps them cover these costs on their personal accounts. I don’t think the two should be put against each other, they are on their own separate paths with very different end goals.
They should TOTALLY be put against each other. As a customer, I look at places where I can get bank account. I don’t look at their business, I just look at the feature set and see what they can offer me over other companies.
I think this is the most positive outcome of the whole kerfuffle. IMHO I think charging a small fee is absolutely fair enough, and I am happy with the £1*. But please do let me deposit my wedding gift money or whatever. Not sure who thought £1000 limit is a good idea but clearly failed to consider some fairly reasonable situations out there. Maybe at least give CS the option to temporary lift up this limit (which is so anti monzo - the moving window limits are hard to understand by most people).
*While I am personally happy to pay it, I do understand that there are some vulnerable people out there. I think such people should be identified and maybe have their fees waived. Or say no charge for small deposits (especially if you are in overdraft). I’d rather subsidize them rather than feed of them (like traditional business do e.g. most charge-for-use ATMs tend to be in deprived areas)
I find this such a strange comment. I joined Monzo to help budget, I chose them as I’d heard of them so to me are a trusted bank - but they’re a bank and I’m a customer. If I see a bank who offer a better deal then I’ll switch.
I don’t look at their goals or paths or business models (other than them being ethical).
Brand loyalty isn’t something that affects the majority of people when it comes to banking. I’d guess (and this is nothing more than a gut feeling) the vast majority of people want to know their money is:
Making a bit of interest
I checked the first two (FSCS and having a debit card) and took a hit on the last as I was struggling to budget. Paying in cheques was the next must-have. As for cash, I’d never thought of it as I can’t remember the last time I went to a bank to pay it in.
The main thing I guess Monzo need to make sure is that they don’t lose money in the long run and Tom has explained why they’re charging (looks like a minority took the piss in the past). If Monzo are looking like they’re struggling, even slightly, then there’ll be a run on them and we all saw what happened to Northern Rock.
I don’t follow - you are not going to get traction with the majority of UK personal customers if you charge for basic banking like this. There are no whizzy app features that would offset a fee to deposit or withdraw your own cash for the average UK consumer. Other countries and business users will be different - but you are introducing a massive blocker to growth, which seems silly to me as the nation is becoming cashless & deposits / withdrawals will scale down over time.
The fact that you don’t have an expensive branch network should mean you have the ability to fund this - people don’t pay dramatically more at Natwest, Barclays or HSBC for their day to day banking than Monzo. Even if you use an overdraft, it’s not easy to say Monzo or the others are cheaper - Monzo wins on service and features, not price. If you think price is your consumer USP, then you don’t understand UK consumers.
“There are no whizzy app features that would offset a fee to deposit or withdraw your own cash for the average UK consumer.”
There is no fee to withdraw cash ?
The whizzy app suits me , it won’t suit others , I don’t deposit cash, if I ever receive it I just use the old old fashioned way and stick it in my wallet and spend it next time I want to buy something - I know others that are paid cash in hand are different and will either choose to pay the £1 fee or use another bank to save the £1 - you cant please all the people all the time
Not at the moment, once the legacy banks have killed off their branch network and are relying on third parties like the Post Office as well, you’ll see the cost of accounts and therefore cash deposits go up…