I bought some boots from Schuh and Klarna did a soft check despite me paying for them in full. Schuh just claimed it’s in their T&Cs that they can do it.
Soft check is just to confirm your identity. It has no bearing on credit score, other lenders can’t see it etc. It’s not really a credit check.
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And another innovation for the Apple Card. A changing CVC.
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JaJa used to have that here, then they removed all innovative features.
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Unlikely when you keep bumping it to claim more moral high ground.
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I don’t think it’s going to happen. I don’t think the UK is as big as the US market with credit cards. Apple would probably lose money building it for the UK
But…
I could be wrong
Would an Apple card really even be all that useful or different to what you can get with Monzo anyways? 
. Though I see that this thread is almost 400 messages already, so I’m sure the answer lies buried above.
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But the decent rewards are paid for by much higher interchange fees, which we don’t have in the U.K.
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3% cashback at Apple
2% everything else
Wallet app crashes when I click apply (I know it’s not here in the UK yet, just being curious)
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Eh? That’s quite a strong statement. What exactly is missing from everything else? You just want some cash back…?
Adding C obviously excludes the elephant in the room!
I also feel like A doesn’t even count as no one besides Amex is offering any decent rewards (in the UK) and Apple aren’t in the business of leaving free money on the table.
Lastly, IMHO people over index on a great app to the exclusion of things like a great website, which still counts for a lot. I get that the whole point of Apple is platform exclusivity but it still wouldn’t sit right with me that I could only view my credit card transactions on an iDevice.
I’d prefer not to get rewards or cash back; I think that both are degenerate. I’d prefer to pay for my bank and have them do banking things well. I’ve never, ever had a problem with Mastercard, either. I mean, to be honest I just don’t see it.
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It’s slightly reductive to say that that you’d rather pay for your bank and have it do things well.
Paying for an account is by no means a guarantee of quality. I don’t pay for Starling and on balance I’d say they’re the best account I’ve ever had.
I also only pay £1 a month for my 123 Lite account, which is a perfectly average account but is very financially rewarding.
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You’re being paid to use a service, so you’re just getting charged elsewhere in the system. There’s no such thing as a free lunch. And I think you should be less happy with a business model like this - for analogous reasons Facebook and Google both exploit your data and it makes the world a worse place overall / both for you and in the macro. Better to pay for a service and receive a service; to not have conflicts of interest between the customer and the person who’s actually paying.
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What is going on here 
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Don’t credit cards offer the rewards so that you spend money with them and then a >0% of people can’t pay it in full and attract interest?
So if you can clear it down every month the rewards are a nice bonus.
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£2?
No, it’s economic reality.
Not really - firstly it’s neutral vs paying you, and secondly with things like Plus and Premium you have an actual honest model of product-for-services.
The fees have been capped though - you remember that right? Tom had a whole long bit about this early on in Monzo history, and how the model was broken and Monzo wouldn’t be following that path. Same logic applies today.
Because if you’re not the customer, you’re the product.
This is meant as a metaphor of the general business model and its incentives. Taking it literally misses the point.
Indeed, but not paying for it ensures that they are.
It’s the same point as above, just reiterated in a different form. Inside a company, because of the way top-down management works, the work that is pursued is work that makes more money, by serving the customer. When the customer is not the user this at best results in stagnant products (effort is spent on the actual customer instead), and at worst direct exploitation of the user (c.f. Google, Facebook). I have seen this dynamic first-hand. Thereore it’s better not to have a conflict of interest over whether to serve the user or the customer by having the user actually be the customer.
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With respect, I think you’re missing the point. As far as I can see, this being an Apple card is neither here nor there. The argument is:
- In the US interchange isn’t as regulated (if at all) than as in Europe.
- This means that card providers make excess profits. Some of them share them with cardholders.
- Instead of having excess profit splashing around the system, wouldn’t it be better to reduce that and to have customers pay for the service they receive?
- customers will rail against that, but it’s likely to be a net positive: companies become more responsive to customer need, more responsive to competition and the market is clearer for cardholders, issuers, acquirers and merchants.
- this can be translated into the UK current account market (which is where I think @duncang was going): for a “free” product banks tend to make money from the poorest (or those not on top of their finances): fees for bounced direct debits, overdraft fees (until recently particularly unauthorised overdrafts) etc. This was regressive: the poor paid for free banking for the rich. Some of this also applies to credit cards: fees for late payments, for exceeding limits etc.
- In cases like that, shifting the fee to be upfront gives clarity. Customers can choose where to bank by comparing their fees. Monzling would clear up because their cost base is less. The US credit card market gives you “free” stuff. But nothing is ever “free” - someone is paying for all those 3% cashbacks or whatever. Ultimately the customer through disguised cost elsewhere.
That’s my interpretation of the argument. Apple (and Monzo) are the sideshow - it’s about the systems within which they operate.
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But you’re not; you’re just paying yourself. Prices have to be marked up to cover card processing costs.
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