The Great Permacrises

Ah thanks for this.

Makes sense I guess, but who knows.

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I guess that’s the issue. We don’t know (evidence & economic theory says it won’t but we might get lucky). But we do know for certain that borrowing a lot at high interest rates will need to be paid back soon. It’s a huge increase in risk, and the markets will react to that by down valuing the currency.

There are tried and tested ways to boost an economy with borrowing, like infrastructure spending, military spending etc, they just don’t fit with the governments ideology

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We dont even know what we will be borrowing as its a fluctuating energy price, which I think is the majority of the borrowing ( ?? ) …but the “new Govt” are encouraging infrastructure to proceed faster …whether some sections of society will accept that …who knows

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I don’t think they’ve done anything for infrastructure at all have they?

Section 3.37

No they haven’t yet, apart from the colossal HS2 …mind you we are what 1 month into trussonomics admittedly after 12 years of Tories

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The IFS bit I glanced at said that reduction will be around a £5b cost for the year but they said if nothing changes in declared income at the top the cost for the top cut could be £6b. The gov estimates £2b cost.

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The sooner this scum get booted out, the better

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if there are 27million lower rate tax payers on an average of 30K a 1% cut in income tax costs around 8.1bn in my calcs …but Im not an economist

and 600000 ish higher rate tax payers :man_shrugging:

Which is why I used the IFS given the gov didn’t want to call it an emergency budget and avoided the scrutiny.

A 1ppt cut to the basic rate of income tax announced previously by then-Chancellor Rishi Sunak, from 20% to 19%, has also been brought forward by one year to April 2023. Hence income taxpayers will gain for an additional year from a tax cut worth an average of £125 per year for basic-rate taxpayers, and £377 per year for all higher-rate taxpayers, at a one-off cost to the exchequer of around £5 billion.
Finally, the 45% additional rate of income tax applying to incomes above £150,000 per year will (for those living outside Scotland) be abolished from April. Instead the 600,000 people currently paying this additional rate - about 1.1% of adults - will simply pay the standard “higher rate” of 40%.
The government says that cutting the top rate from 45% to 40% will cost about £2 billion per year. If no-one increased their declared taxable income in response to the change, we estimate that it would cost about £6 billion per year: hence, the government is assuming that roughly two-thirds of the mechanical reduction in revenue is recouped due to behavioural responses. That looks like a plausible estimate, but the main thing to emphasise is the large uncertainty around it: it is not implausible that it will cost significantly more than £2 billion. It might plausibly cost nothing at all.

Not exactly a ringing endorsement but this is why we needed the OBR report but they didn’t want that. Even now it’s not called an emergency budget, just a fiscal event….

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Someone’s made some money in the last 24 hours.

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That may be because the BoE are expected to make an announcement.

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Ms Truss at her first PMQ;

I can tell that she is—she is already contacting people in Doncaster and Sheffield to make sure that we protect the airport and protect that vital infrastructure and connectivity that helps our economy to grow.

https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/2022-09-07/debates/D77D5A84-50EF-4624-9712-6593D88C5B95/Engagements?highlight=doncaster#contribution-D597F18E-1874-4060-869A-ABDD9D8F8B38

And today;

This I fear is the truth that many don’t want to accept. Our country is a bag of sh*te for many:

Essentially, US & UK are poor societies with some very rich people.

Then this:

No free meals in England unless you have a household income of less than £7500 I believe. That’s not the case in Scotland though.

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Massive ‘it’s not a party, it’s a work event’ vibes

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so the Economists dont have a clue what it will cost either… so we’re all in the same boat blowing smoke :grinning:

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A fiscal event is to a budget what a special military operation is to a war.

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It’s such a lie. It is an emergency budget but they were happy to avoid the OBR I fear thinking it would spook the markets, that worked out well…

My point was you saying how much more everything was costing for the 1% reduction over the top rate. They have no idea exactly the true cost of the top cut and it could be bad and close to the same cost and we don’t have an OBR report to judge.

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or nil cost :man_shrugging: according to the IFS equally the OBR have had some howler forecasts just as the IMF and ECB

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My point is flippant statements about the huge cost of that cut over the top cut are not knowns right now and are not accurate. The IFS say £6b if nothing changes, the gov assumes changes reducing to £2b but it’s a shot in the dark and if it’s high it will be much the same.

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