Even if some people stubbornly refuse to let cheques die, one group is embracing the new technology.
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Itâs the banks that would lose out if more fraud happens if they raise the limit⌠So⌠If theyâre willing to raise the limit they are obviously happy with the level of risk. Something doesnât make sense here, FUD article?
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Of course itâs a FUD article. Contactless fraud is incredibly rare, and cheque fraud is getting harder due to the sheer lack of cheques and ease of catching it.
Better title âincredibly rare form of fraud slightly more common than fraud with ancient and nearly discontinued systemâ.
Now, as a percentage of transactions being fraudulent, Iâd bet cheques are orders of magnitude higher than contactlessâŚ
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The article mentions stealing card details by contactless as well. Is that even possible? Would that have to be contactless magstripe?
Itâs possible to get some details (PAN and expiration date) but no merchant should be completing a transaction with just that. You canât get name, CVC2, etc.
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Define incredibly rare.
Theft of card and use of contactless is not uncommon.
A fraction of a percent of transactions. Low enough itâs easily covered by interchange as a cost of doing business.
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Is there not two different issues here?
Copying cards of unsuspecting victims with a card reader I believe is incredibly rare although simply stealing cards and using the contactless feature to purchase a few ÂŁ30 items before it gets blocked must be pretty common. Some numbers would be interesting
Yes
In 2017 the BBC quoted contactless fraud was 2.7% of contactless spending. But they canât do maths. It was actually 0.027% ( BBC News )
Exactly, if it was 2.7% banks would quit issuing the things. 0.027% vs interchange at 0.2%-0.3% - itâs a manageable risk and should improve with online-first cards.
Oh, and you are the one who said ânot uncommonâ above. Iâd consider 0.027% rather uncommon, rare⌠even incredibly rare. Obviously if you work in a bankâs fraud department youâll see it every day. But in the general population, itâs incredibly rare.
Impossible, actually. You can get some data off the card which might be usable for a pre-play contactless magstripe purchase (one) or for some very insecure CNP merchant who only asks card number and expiration. But you canât copy the card, you canât make a working clone.
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Loss and theft of bank cards is not uncommon. ÂŁ7m lost to contactless fraud in 2016. I dare say that figure is probably higher now.
Depends whether you wish to talk percentages (of very large numbers) or actual sums involved.
I spoke to a victim of fraud last week whoâd lost ÂŁ780ish to contactless fraud (although was reimbursed by the bank).
On that basis, Contactless is safer than cash.
Thanks for the correction.
So since copying the card doesnât work. And I believe just wandering around town with a card reader charging people ÂŁ30 at a time doesnât really work either since this would be easily traceable, these figures must be stolen cards that are used in order to purchase goods for resale.
Doesnât seem like a very effective scamâŚ
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Exactly⌠they got their money back, which cash⌠nope.
Almost entirely, yes. There are some trivial amounts of pre-play contactless magstripe fraud starting to show up since contactless is getting more popular in the US on terminals, but almost none of them are EMV-mode.
You could just read it as âCheque fraud falls below contactless for the first time, because so few cheques are being usedâ
As far as the quote âBank of Englandâs chief cashier Victoria Cleland, she had heard instances of money being âtaken off contactless when you walk past somethingââ I really hope that was the reporter making stuff up (Itâs probably possible in some way, but I canât see it happening by accident and not a risk Iâd expect a BoE spokesman to be highlighting).
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Also, I forgot to reply to this part. I want to talk percentages, because theyâre the only thing thatâs actually relevant. Obviously, in terms of sums, even rare fraud will be huge sums on an incredibly popular payment system. The percentage, though - the only thing that really matters - sits well below interchange (which, among other things, is intended to cover the cost of fraud losses the bank is liable for).
What are the sums of stolen cash each year, to compare? And what percentage of that is returned to the owner (nearly zero⌠whereas only gross negligence will cause you to lose out for lost/stolen card fraudâŚ).
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You steal the card and resell it to mules - 10 contactless cards, only ÂŁ150; they go out and spend the money
Thankfully, online priority is going to help this so much! Youâll have to be much quicker to use the card.
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Not to point out that there was 405 million cheques used as payments and to acquire cash across the UK in 2017. Hardly a sheer lack of cheques!
A bit under five per person. I can easily make that many contactless transactions in a day.
That said Iâm still shocked itâs anywhere near five per person. Iâve been getting a bit under one a year. So some people must be using them weekly!
Maybe what we need is a tax on cheques like Ireland has? Donât get me wrong - I definitely wouldnât want to see their debit and credit card taxes those are absurd. But a cheque tax would cause people to realise the real cost to society of using cheques.
I guess I just come from a part of the country I see cheques a lot used to pay trades people or for my employer (a school) so when people state cheques are going the way of the dodo, I point it out 
.
The Cheque and Credit Clearing Company gives the following about cheque use:
87% of charities said they had either made or received a payment by cheque in the past month
53% of charities said they receive donation income by cheque
29% of charities said they receive over half their donation income by cheque
75% of UK businesses said that they had either made or received a payment by cheque in the past month
55% of UK personal account holders said that they had either made or received a payment by cheque in the past year
I remember they tried to phase out cheques a few years back but they backtracked. You are right, if banks charged the actual costs of clearing a cheque (or were taxed), however small it was, might start making people use other options.
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