NFC payments while driving


(Change Works) #1

When Apple Pay does eventually arrive, then, according to this rather bizarre article, we won’t be able to use it at a drive through.

Luckily, for Android users, Google Pay isn’t mentioned, so you guys may be OK.

Also, aren’t drive through some normally not public roads? Any legal experts know if that make a difference?


When will Monzo support Apple Pay?
(Allie) #2

That’s ridiculous, wow…


(Ben Green) #3

Should be fine your classed at parked, which in case of below you would be.

GMP Traffic said: “If your engine is off and your handbrake applied and you’re parked yes. If your engine is on NO.”


(Jack) #4

I’d have thought this wouldn’t be against the law as mc Donald’s is private land and isn’t on a public road so to speak but thinking about it I’m not sure if that even makes a difference!
I’m sure the police wouldn’t fine people for using their phone in this instance, unless they wanted to be extremely petty.


(Allie) #5

Which I’m pretty sure isn’t exactly uncommon…


(Jack Donovan) #6

Good old Android, :sunglasses: that article is bizarre, but I guess it kinda makes sense…


#7

This article is Flawed. McDonald’s drive thru is “PRIVATE LAND” therefore not subject to the road traffic act. That’s why Parking cannot be enforced by civil authorities on private land, unless that that vehicle poses “An imminent Danger to the Public” I know this as I was given a ticket on
My road. Which is a Private road! Alas the officer was poorly educated on the law . Ticket was written off. That’s why Ozzy Ozbourne never got Arrested for careless driving when he crashed his vehicle on his PRIVATE LAND half drunk a few properties away. Poor reporting from a poor publication.


#8

No I wouldn’t stop using it… Google does take a cut* of the transaction fee, but only a very small cut - Monzo still make money, just slightly less money than if you used the plastic card. But the big idea is the convenience speed and security of mobile payments, plus the fact that you’re more likely to have your phone on you than your wallet, means you make more purchases with it. Plus it’s better to make smaller purchases with, as from Monzos point of view it’s much better than cash. Withdrawing cash DOES cost Monzo quite a bit.

Edit: *probably does take a cut… I assumed they did because Apple definitely does, but maybe google don’t!


(Nick Perry) #9

Whilst the article is ridiculous scaremongering it is not true that driving offences are limited only to those roads which are maintained by the public purse. Many accessible private lands, such as approach roads, car parks etc count for the purpose of many offences. Particularly those involving safety. However there is always a public interest test in deciding whether to prosecute. And its hard to see how prosecuting in these circumstances would be in the public interest. If you are doing it in a car with no MoT and faulty brakes however…


#10

Totally agree. I worked for a firm involved in a court case where private land was deemed public space for prosecution purposes due to the ease of access and common public use, despite signage.


(Jamie 🏳️‍🌈) #11

Public and private land doesn’t mean what you expect it to mean. Most land in this country is ‘owned’ by something or someone. The term ‘public’ has specific meanings in law, dependent on the context. As does the term ‘road’, which is legally defined in Scotland differently to the definition in England and Wales.

The point I’m making is: If you don’t know what you’re talking about –

it does no one any help to make stuff up.


(Jack Donovan) #12

The fact McDonald’s drive thru is private land so doesn’t comply with the road traffic act is obviously rubbish.

Under that analogy, you could drive a car without a licence round a Tesco car park :yum:


#13

The problem with UK Law is that it is based on Case Law, with differing interpretations and rulings leading to conflicting judgements. However with case judgements ruling some private land as public in nature nobody can be totally sure certain areas of private land open to the public are not regarded as public for the purpises of interpreting and enforcing certain Acts of Parliament.

The article refered to earlier in this thread is not new news but a repeat or rehash of previous news articles a year or so ago.


(Jamie 🏳️‍🌈) #14

I see that not as a problem, but as a benefit. Everyone, if they believe their circumstances are unique, gets to argue their case in court, and be guided by what has already been argued (and ruled upon) in the past.


#15

The problem I found was lower Court judges not having the guts to make a decision and refering a case upwards. In the end I took the Attorney General to the High Court in the Strand just to get a confident judge to make a ruling and decide which Act had precidence over another in certain circumstances (without discussing the case here as it not related to banking). The judge in her ruling expressed surprise that lower level judges had not reached what was to both her and I a simple decision. Without case law and instead a proper constitution and a concrete list of the priority of Acts would make interpretation of Law easier, and in my case saved tens of thousands of pounds (which I did not need to spend, but it was over a point of principle, proving I was right).


#16

I Disagree through experience. One of my vehicles was clamped by the DVLA (Untaxed) & after the we sent them
Proof of Private land they had to remove it & Compensate :slight_smile:


(Jamie 🏳️‍🌈) #17

But Vehicle Excise Duty isn’t covered by the Road Traffic Act. We’re talking about the definition of a road as defined by that Act.


(Allie) #18

Remember that this is a hefty charge and an easy way for the police to ‘slam the book’ on someone - they have all the evidence they need the ‘crime’ occurred. CCTV and bank records.

Your only hope, really, would be jury nullification. And we all know how rare that is… I wouldn’t risk it…


(Jamie 🏳️‍🌈) #19

A simple offence of using a mobile phone whilst driving on a road is a summary offence – there is no jury involved.


(Marcus Nailor) #20

Ah thank goodness for stop-start engines :joy::oncoming_automobile:

I hope that stronger restrictions bring fear into the hearts of drivers illegally using their phones whilst driving… But so long as I don’t drive through the drive-thru on my phone, i.e. only taking it out of my pocket at the payment window and putting it away again, then there should be no issue whatsoever :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

But thankfully I’m using Android Google Pay, not Apple Pay :wink: