Payment made from deleted card (again)

It sounds like that’s what has happened here, yes.

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Ah okay, I thought as much but wasn’t sure: thanks :smiling_face:

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There’s definitely some sort of weird loophole that allows for a this. A completely different card network, but last week I checked into a hotel and handed over my corporate credit card to be used for the booking.
Checked out and they told me they’d bill the card I used at check in.
A few hours later a charge came through on the American Express card I’d last used there two years ago.
Ultimately it’s fine, and my employer will cover the fx fee, but how a card I’d used two years ago could be charged is bizarre to me. This wasn’t a big chain hotel either where I have my card attached to my account.

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I think this is a “no cardholder verification” transaction. Basically, putting through a charge using the card details with no verification at all (just keyed manually) and going straight to presentment with no authorisation first. I believe this is technically possible but it is always allowed, as a cardholder, to chargeback a transaction of this type as no amount of “evidence” will be accepted by Mastercard from the merchant in the case of a dispute.

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This topic seems is very deja vu.

I remember commenting to say that the websites we operate have a feature with our subscriptions that gets the latest card details from the bank.

So if you replace your card the service still runs/charges uninterrupted.

As others have mentioned. Just cancel it with the merchant. As you’re finding out it’s far more hassle to go this route.

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I tried to cancel, and they said I needed to call, I called and got stuck in a queue for 20 mins. I hung up and cancelled the card.

Then you are still contractually required to continue paying them. Cancelling a card, is not how you cancel subscriptions with a contractual obligation.

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Martin Lewis debunked that notion in the series finale of the latest season of his show on ITVx.

You can just as much ask your bank to put an end to them as the merchant, and they have to.

If there’s some other agreement with the merchant that determines you owe them money, then that’s a civil dispute between them and you and they should take you to court over it. The bank isn’t there to adjudicate and determine those matters.

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Sure, you can - but they haven’t. They cancelled their card. That’s not asking your bank to cancel a CPA/payment subscription.

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Yep agreed, as I said these could be charged back. And they are rare, still though they do exist.

When you replace a card, you can opt to have existing details updated. This isn’t what happened here, this was a virtual card that I subsequently deleted.

If this was a genuine CPA / Payment subscription - which I don’t believe it is. Then why did they go through eight failed transactions.

This was supposed to be one of the benefits of virtual cards, that you can use them with suspect merchants and not have to worry about it afterwards.

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When it comes to virtual cards, I’d have thought cancelling the card would be sufficient (it was one of the use cases promoted by marketing when it launched). It’s the whole reason Privacy.com was born. A cancelled card is supposed to stop working, after all. It wasn’t until @breville_monkey’s posts here that I learned otherwise.

That hasn’t happened here, and now they are trying to contact Monzo to get that resolved and the payment stopped and refunded, with little success it seems. So they’re trying to do the very thing you’re berating them for not, but via the bank, not the merchant.

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Yea, I’m more berating them for not cancelling the subscription properly in the first place when it happened years ago, or asking Monzo to cancel the CPA a couple of years ago. Instead of now retrospectively asking them to cancel it. :sweat_smile: But sure, whichever way you want to spin it.

Without knowing the merchant, it’s hard to know if this is a specific thing that merchant’s doing weird. But some Googling shows that some merchants don’t obey standard Mastercard rules and force the transaction through in some way against an old card. :man_shrugging: Monzo should chargeback the payment, but the OP also needs to request the CPA be cancelled - if there even is one in place.

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This.

People tend to overthink the banks position in some situations, and this is a prime example.

:joy:

Did you hope they’d forget about you?

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I was referring to the merchants side.

When you have a contractual agreement and a card saved with the merchant, they can request your updated card details direct from the bank to take payment.

If this is what happened then you’re at fault, nobody else. You have to pay what is owed and/or continue paying if you’re in a contract. You can’t circumvent your legal obligations and the agreement you made with them by simply cancelling your card.

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Bang on. I’ve had this happen with old Natwest cards too. Part of the reason why they say to cut them up, and destroy the magnetic strip.

I also used to work at a bank call centre, and the amount of people I dealt with who thought they could get me to cancel their Sky TV subscription, or get their money back from a direct debit they set up but forgot to cancel was mind-boggling! :rofl:

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CPAs seem to be a Mastercard / Visa “afterthought” and in my opinion either need to be fixed or scrapped.

The fact that consumers cannot see a list of CPAs and cancel them directly in the same way we can with direct debits is a problem that should be regulated harder.

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Seeing them I agree with. But deleting them wouldn’t really help matters.

They bills are still due :melting_face::joy:

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Maybe not necessarily a delete button, but a block or cancel button. Maybe that’s what they meant but chose the wrong word.

Consumers have two avenues for cancelling CPAs. With the merchant or with your bank. Currently to go the bank route you have to deal with CS. So a button to cancel them would streamline and automate the self serve process.

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