Dozens Discussion & Feedback


They are clearly different approaches.

Chip have decided to burn through a portion of their own money to pay interest to savers with no current way of covering these outgoings with a source of income. Clearly not sustainable.

Dozen’s are using their money to insure their initial bond offerings (for want of a better term). They presumably expect they will earn 5% or more on the bond market so don’t expect to actually spend all the money they put in trust accounts as insurance.

So yes - anyone could decide to offer 5% or 10% or whatever by burning through their startup funds to get users on board (what Chip seem to be doing). But that does not seem to be the approach Dozens are taking.


I thought the same as you, but I’m not sure it’s the case.

(Splodf) #694

That’s not how it works.You’re buying bonds in Dozens.


Ok, that now makes sense to me. But simply saying we are buying bonds in Dozen’s is not how I think they initially communicated it.

(Stephen Spencer) #696

Whoa, largest bid 20k!! I was thinking of bidding a “decent” amount but assumed that anything north of £500 wouldn’t “win” … maybe I need get in on the next go!

(Jordan) #697

I think this is because it was an “early adopters” roll out so there were maybe circa 500 (plus Dozens employees) able to get in on the deal. Once the user base reaches 1,000 I think it’ll be difficult to get anything north of £200-300.

EDIT: although the March bid is £1m and not £100,000


Only 62 successful bids though.

I managed to get in with a relatively large amount (feeling smug right now…).

But sadly it’s not challenging the 20K!

(Rob) #699

Actually that is not correct. I have seen speculation that the Trust Bonds are mini-bonds but this is not the case.

These retail bonds are listed by us, but in this case we are not using the money invested for any activity - whether operating costs or investment. It is being kept apart in a trust for the benefit of customers. It is a way of rewarding our customers and funded by us (as has been pointed out) and although this costs us money, it can be subsidised (in our case) by other revenue generation activities. I can’t comment on how others might be funding their offers.

The value of the money in these accounts to dozens is not the cash itself, but the fact that customers are joining dozens and exploring our app, our savings (not spending or borrowing) concepts, and looking at the opportunities for savings and investments.

This is primarily aimed at being a regular savings vehicle rather than a “free money” bonanza for those with existing saving pots. Regular savers will not have thousands of pounds to move into savings every month, so we want to make sure we reward this behaviour and have the ability to offer it consistently each month. Having said that, the March bond issuance will be for a total of £1m - so there will be something for a lot of people.

It would, of course, be nice to get 5% fixed-interest on £50k+ pots of savings for virtually no risk, but that couldn’t last (as has been pointed out). Of course it is possible that you could get this, because of our bid model, just as it could be possible to get a Banksy artwork for a bargain at an auction if no-one else turns up to bid. You never know :wink:

If you have larger savings pots there will soon be other bonds and investment options available for you to choose from for a range of risk appetites, including very low risk.

We are in this for the long term with our customers so this Trust Bond is an investment, but a sensible one.

(Splodf) #700

I never said you was.

Essentially, my understanding is we buy a bond in you.

You put the bond money in a trust +5%

You pay it back 12 months on.

It’s still a Dozens bond, just not in the traditional sense.

If I’m still wrong, I give up with the Dozens bonds, they’re too complex for mere mortals to understand.

(Rob) #701

Sorry, I was responding in more general terms to the conversation above yours about us expecting a return. I realise from your comments above that you do understand - I was just grabbing this as a conversation “jump off point” and not meant as a criticism :slight_smile:


(Splodf) #702

No worries, I’d assumed you’d been reading the MoneySavingExpert threads :wink:

(Richard) #703

Why are you no longer on those threads @rob_dozens were you kicked off and given a reason at least?

(Rob) #704

It is very frustrating

They ask you to apply for verified status, but take over a week to get back to you so it looks like you don’t care.

I waited several days in the first instance, then replied very openly on the thread about how I was waiting for the verification, but MSE eventually deleted my comment after the fact. I still have no verified status, so cannot post without getting deleted or banned, and have to sit and wait.

I can understand if I was selling, but I try very hard to stick to all forum rules. As a moderator and admin myself I know it is a tough job



That does sound a bit ridiculous. Glad to have you contributing here!

(Splodf) #706

But how do we know you’re the real Rob from Dozens?

(Richard) #707

:musical_score: Will the real Rob from Dozens please stand up, please stand up :musical_score:

(Jordan) #708

I am Rob from Dozens…

… No I am Rob from Dozens…



I believe there are twelve Robs from Dozens.

(Splodf) #710

Let’s close the thread here. We’ve peaked.


I demand exactly 12 likes for my comment. No more, no less. (Unless the final one is from a verified baker).

then we close the thread.

We won’t be closing the thread